I’m not in the habit of discussing the “Westboro Baptist Church.” However, a great many people are, and we need to get more accuracy on their Google footprint.
So here I am with that. BoWilliams.com is about service to others.
First of all, Westboro Baptist Church is not a Baptist church. “Baptist Church” is part of their name because that is what they have named themselves. No recognized or sanctioned Baptist organization, large or small, claims Westboro. It is exactly as if I said I had conquered the universe because I started calling myself “Bo Williams, Conqueror of the Universe.”
Westboro has fewer than 40 members, nearly all of them related to each other. Most of them are descended from Fred Phelps, Westboro’s founder.
Westboro gets press very far out of proportion to its size. This is partially because they are crafty marketers, but mostly because they are regularly trotted out as some sort of counterpoint to radical Islam. “See,” some bloviating nitwit will sniff, “Christianity has its own problems.”
Eh, no. Westboro is not a problem of Christianity whatsoever. It’s three dozen or so hateful people with a really small gene pool in a Topeka neighborhood, receiving regular injections of currency from those with anti-Christian agendas.
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Lofty title.
And if you think your Christian views of “all gays are going to hell” and Westboro’s signs of “all gays are going to hell” outside of funerals are all that different, then you need to write a thinkpiece about your own shortcomings called “All You Need To Know About People Who Will Never Grow As Humans Because They Can’t Understand Maybe Society As A Whole PLUS Where He Was Raised Had Huge Systemic Influences On His Belief System: Bigotry Isn’t Always As Loud As Westboro.”
To be sure, not all bigotry is on purpose. Most of it actually isn’t. But you refuse to see that, and therein lies why things like racism, sexism, etc., continue to exist. Because good people (not being sarcastic, you actually seem quite well-intentioned) like you choose to hate “the others” passive aggressively, refusing to call into question how damaging your thinking is. Won’t even consider it. Because “Of course I’m not racist!” Except we all are. We all do/say/think racist-centric things. And guess what? That’s okay! We’re human! Most of us weren’t raised in a world that called these things into question. What matters is that we admit it and keep moving. But you, my dear, don’t admit anything. Ever. And if that sounds patronizing, it’s merely because I’m copying your writing style.
(And “but…no…i’ve broken bread with gays. I have a gay neighbor. I have prayed alongside them” is extremely short-sighted. Please see how you can break bread with someone and still think they’re going to rot in hell. The two aren’t mutually exclusive.) And you can say they don’t deserve to die like this and that shootings are tragic, but you believe they should die by natural causes, later on, and pay for their sins. So. You’re cool with them dying and being punished; you just don’t think it should happen at this very second. Interesting.
Christianity has its own problems, and literally the ONLY reason people use Westboro as the go-to example is precisely because of their large media following. Everyone knows it. Can’t really call someone a nitwit for referencing something that everyone knows and everyone is aware of. Kind of like if I’m a teacher and I’m writing a word problem about flowers, I’ll likely choose a flower that the kids know and understood. That’s pretty much what all humans do. So I’m a bit confused as to why you don’t understand that very simple thing.
So when people use Westboro as an example, that’s precisely what they’re doing – examples that everyone knows. If you want to blame anyone for that, blame the media. Don’t blame people for understanding your mental limits about your own religion and referencing people you see as radical, since you couldn’t possibly fathom the fact that several of your views are quite radical. But not you, of course. You have zero privilege – except for the privilege of being 100% correct, 100% of the time.
Most of your stuff lately sounds like it’s straight off the Breitbart page. I thought Huntsville was supposed to be the progressive city around those parts. And yes, I can’t WAIT to hear the article about how you were victimized in the comments. By one single comment. Go ahead. Everyone who reads this is from your own belief group, so it really doesn’t matter what you say. It’s kind of like being at a Trump rally. (“But Trump is so extreme!” you may say. Yea. So are a lot of the claims you make.)
Furthermore, if this is the worst comment you’ve ever had on this site, and if you’re not getting called gendered slurs daily just for existing online in a public way, maybe rethink your sexist stances, too. Death threats. Rape threats. Pretty much everything I know that you do not get daily just for existing online publicly. Must be nice up there in your ivory Trump Tower. So if this comment is what victimizes you, because you don’t get rape threats every day, then please try to at least pretend to understand that maybe genders aren’t equal, which was another Breitbart-esque article I saw on here a few months ago.
I used to have you bookmarked because you seemed like a pretty cool guy and my cousin said you’re cool, too. But good lord. Get off your high horse. I understand that you think zero types of inequalities exist and that you are 100% blameless in the bigotry department. But no. That’s not how that works. That’s not how any of that works. Breitbart-esque views exactly like that are what make lgbtq+ people feel unsafe and want to die daily. And if you honestly think that there’s nothing wrong with a viewpoint that does that, then go right ahead. Unbookmarking.
Emma, thank you for your thoughts.
You seem to have done a little gunnysacking here, responding to other things you’ve read here on BoWilliams.com in one gigantic comment. It’ll be much easier in the future if you respond as you go (if indeed you intend to continue reading). Nevertheless, I’ll do the best I can. (Your original comments in italics below.)
Lofty title.
Indeed. I have a high opinion of my views and my writing ability. Moreover, when people are undecided, I am happy to tell them what to think. This is a free service.
And if you think your Christian views of “all gays are going to hell” and Westboro’s signs of “all gays are going to hell” outside of funerals are all that different, then you need to write a thinkpiece about your own shortcomings called “All You Need To Know About People Who Will Never Grow As Humans Because They Can’t Understand Maybe Society As A Whole PLUS Where He Was Raised Had Huge Systemic Influences On His Belief System: Bigotry Isn’t Always As Loud As Westboro.”
This rather bizarre remark tells me you’ve spent very little time with me before deciding you know what I think.
I started BoWilliams.com in October 2006. I am making the 10,426th published comment on its 3,005th post. Should we make a wager? Can you find a single instance of me condemning homosexuality on this blog anywhere?
I love my gay friends and family, and expect to see them in heaven. I have felt no particular torment concerning my views on gay people since perhaps 1986.
To be sure, not all bigotry is on purpose. Most of it actually isn’t. But you refuse to see that, and therein lies why things like racism, sexism, etc., continue to exist. Because good people (not being sarcastic, you actually seem quite well-intentioned)
I am. I want a better world.
like you choose to hate “the others” passive aggressively,
I don’t hate anyone. I need help not hating anyone sometimes, for sure.
refusing to call into question how damaging your thinking is. Won’t even consider it. Because “Of course I’m not racist!” Except we all are.
Speak for yourself. I’m not racist. I reject utterly that as a white male, I’m, on some sociocultural level, hopelessly racist and there’s little I can do about it but hang my head, wring my hands, and feel guilty about it. Moreover, I have found that people who do those things themselves and invite me to tend to be, at best, sincere but misguided; or at worst, operating with authoritarian motives.
I do need to get a bit more into the notion of microaggression. Still mulling how to come at that more thoughtfully than I did the first time.
We all do/say/think racist-centric things. And guess what? That’s okay! We’re human! Most of us weren’t raised in a world that called these things into question. What matters is that we admit it and keep moving.
What matters is that we, the first generation to be largely free of institutional racism and sexism, raise children who have no memory or other frame of reference of it being any other way. That’s how it happens. It happens in my five-year-old son not noticing that the driver his dad pulled for in the 2007 Indianapolis 500 was a woman. It happens in that same kid, two years later, not finding any particular significance in that his first puppy love girlfriend was black. Never mentioned it. Wasn’t important.
Call my little bits there anecdotal, or trivial, or whatever, but they wouldn’t have happened that way 30 years ago.
But you, my dear, don’t admit anything. Ever. And if that sounds patronizing, it’s merely because I’m copying your writing style.
Don’t flatter yourself.
(And “but…no…i’ve broken bread with gays. I have a gay neighbor. I have prayed alongside them” is extremely short-sighted. Please see how you can break bread with someone and still think they’re going to rot in hell. The two aren’t mutually exclusive.) And you can say they don’t deserve to die like this and that shootings are tragic, but you believe they should die by natural causes, later on, and pay for their sins. So. You’re cool with them dying and being punished; you just don’t think it should happen at this very second. Interesting.
Again, you have no idea what you’re talking about. I don’t think anything like that, and there is nothing in evidence to suggest such. You have assumed, and it has created a tremendous deficit in your understanding.
Christianity has its own problems,
Oh, you’ve got that right, but hardly how you think.
and literally the ONLY reason people use Westboro as the go-to example is precisely because of their large media following. Everyone knows it. Can’t really call someone a nitwit for referencing something that everyone knows and everyone is aware of. Kind of like if I’m a teacher and I’m writing a word problem about flowers, I’ll likely choose a flower that the kids know and understood. That’s pretty much what all humans do. So I’m a bit confused as to why you don’t understand that very simple thing.
Westboro is used a go-to example for precisely the reason I said: it’s a cheap way to tar Christianity, employed by people with anti-Christian agendas.
The reality is that most of the Christian church is struggling mightily with homosexuality. Some folks are further along than others–gay clergy, gay marriage, and so forth. The Episcopal Church seems like they’re there. Others won’t ever get to acceptance. There is no harder line in the sand for most Southern Baptist congregations, for example. United Methodists are staring it down right now.
So when people use Westboro as an example, that’s precisely what they’re doing – examples that everyone knows. If you want to blame anyone for that, blame the media. Don’t blame people for understanding your mental limits about your own religion and referencing people you see as radical, since you couldn’t possibly fathom the fact that several of your views are quite radical.
Which of my views are radical?
But not you, of course. You have zero privilege – except for the privilege of being 100% correct, 100% of the time.
I try to think about things correctly 100% of the time, for sure. That’s the goal. If it isn’t, why bother thinking at all? But I’ve certainly remained receptive to new information, changes in how I see things, etc. I have several views that have changed over the course of me writing this blog.
Most of your stuff lately sounds like it’s straight off the Breitbart page.
I believe you’ve demonstrably disqualified yourself from credibly talking about “most of (my) stuff.”
I thought Huntsville was supposed to be the progressive city around those parts. And yes, I can’t WAIT to hear the article about how you were victimized in the comments. By one single comment.
I’ve taken the time to answer you because you seem more sincere than not, but uh, no, you don’t get your own post. Sorry.
Go ahead. Everyone who reads this is from your own belief group, so it really doesn’t matter what you say.
It matters to you so little, you left nearly 800 words of commentary.
It’s kind of like being at a Trump rally. (“But Trump is so extreme!” you may say. Yea. So are a lot of the claims you make.)
I’m game. What are my extreme claims, from where you sit?
Furthermore, if this is the worst comment you’ve ever had on this site,
LOL! As I said, the blog is nearly ten years old, and I was on Usenet daily for about 12 years before that. I’ll tell you what, if it makes you feel better: this comment you have left is definitely, absolutely in the top 95% of nasty comments I’ve ever received.
and if you’re not getting called gendered slurs daily just for existing online in a public way, maybe rethink your sexist stances, too. Death threats. Rape threats. Pretty much everything I know that you do not get daily just for existing online publicly. Must be nice up there in your ivory Trump Tower.
I am well aware of what many women with public online presences endure. I have spoken out against it in the past, and I suspect will do so in the future. But online misogyny is not something I will internalize and make my own to any degree whatsoever (even though I’m a wicked old Christian straight white male). I have many sins–we all do–but that is certainly not one of them. I will not apologize for it, because it is not mine.
So if this comment is what victimizes you,
I’m mystified by your transparent need to feel you’ve struck me and made me bleed.
because you don’t get rape threats every day, then please try to at least pretend to understand that maybe genders aren’t equal, which was another Breitbart-esque article I saw on here a few months ago.
That was probably the microaggression piece. Yeah, that one’s ruffled feathers. I was angry when I wrote it, and though I wish I had been more measured, I don’t disagree with anything I wrote. This may be the passage to which you refer:
“When we manufacture discord with open-ended rhetorical witch hunts, we minimize genuine progress. We once had real problems in this country with skin color and sex. Mostly, we don’t anymore.”
I stand by it.
I used to have you bookmarked because you seemed like a pretty cool guy and my cousin said you’re cool, too.
Well, your cousin sounds like a smart person.
But good lord. Get off your high horse.
You’re asking a guy named Bo Williams with a web site called BoWilliams.com to get off his high horse? Okeydokey.
I understand that you think zero types of inequalities exist
You understand a lot of things that turn out to be not so correct, I’ve noticed.
and that you are 100% blameless in the bigotry department. But no. That’s not how that works. That’s not how any of that works. Breitbart-esque views exactly like that are what make lgbtq+ people feel unsafe and want to die daily. And if you honestly think that there’s nothing wrong with a viewpoint that does that, then go right ahead.
Again, I have no views that would make any LGBTQ+ people “feel unsafe and want to die daily.” That you believe I do demonstrates nothing but your shoot-ready-aim approach. You’ve assumed a ton not in evidence, because you crafted your attack before you studied your target.
Unbookmarking.
Aw, so this was all for nothing? I could have been watching the race.